America Has No Proof That Bin Laden was Mastermind of 9/11
Ray Lutz: “Would you not need some form of evidence before you kill the man?”
To the editor:
I was disappointed that the SEAL team failed to capture Osama bin Laden alive, which would have been the proper way to handle it. First, do we actually know this occurred? Is there independent corroboration of the facts, or are reporters happy to take the word of the intelligence department, the same one that had bad information about WMD in Iraq?
The body was disposed of very quickly. Are there any photographs, DNA testing, etc., to prove that this was indeed bin Laden? We’ve been shown lots of archival footage. I want real reporting.
What really gets me about all this coverage is that with the giddy pleasure of seeing a man killed, we forget that we had no hard evidence that 1) this was in fact, Osama bin Laden and 2) he was the ‘mastermind’ behind 9/11.
Given other terrorist attacks he admitted to, perhaps he deserved to die. But he was never linked to 9/11 with hard evidence. The proper way to handle this would be through indictments and a trial.
What actually occurred is that President Bush, in his ultimate wisdom, decided that it was our right to take him out ‘dead or alive.’ Frankly, I don't trust President Bush with the most simple decisions, including whether it was best to continue to read My Pet Goat.
See this interesting article: twf.org/News/Y2006/0608-BinLaden.html
Vice President Cheney says, “We've never made the case, or argued the case, that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11.”
According to the FBI "Wanted" page (fbi.gov/wanted/wanted_terrorists/usama-bin-laden): "Usama Bin Laden is wanted in connection with the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. These attacks killed over 200 people. In addition, Bin Laden is a suspect in other terrorist attacks throughout the world.”
When asked why there is no mention of 9/11 on the FBI’s web page, Rex Tomb, the FBI’s chief of investigative publicity, is reported to have said, "The reason why 9/11 is not mentioned on Usama Bin Laden’s Most Wanted page is because the FBI has no hard evidence connecting Bin Laden to 9/11.”
In fact, Bin Laden, in a Sept. 28, 2001, interview with the Pakistani newspaper Ummat, is reported to have said:
“I have already said that I am not involved in the 11 September attacks in the United States. As a Muslim, I try my best to avoid telling a lie. I had no knowledge of these attacks, nor do I consider the killing of innocent women, children and other humans as an appreciable act. Islam strictly forbids causing harm to innocent women, children and other people. Such a practice is forbidden even in the course of a battle.”
The video supposedly documenting admission was an obvious contrivance and has been dismissed by investigators as reliable evidence. According to the FBI, bin Laden was only a suspect.
Would you not need some form of evidence before you kill the man?
Apparently not in this country, where we lose all sense of due process if the man is a Muslim who likes to express his manhood by holding an AK-47.
But let's say all this is wrong, and bin Laden, according to widely held belief (without hard evidence), was the ‘mastermind’ of 9/11. Then it certainly points out that had Bush focused on Afghanistan instead of getting distracted on false information about weapons of mass destruction that were never found in Iraq, we may have found this huge bunker only a short distance from the border of Pakistan long ago and likely reduced the growth of al Qaeda in Iraq and other areas of the world.
With 20/20 hindsight, we have to conclude that Iraq was clearly the biggest military blunder in all recorded history.
I find it interesting that the bunker was finally found and the operation commenced just prior to the move of Leon Panetta from CIA director to defense secretary, which was just announced last week. Panetta was credited with being behind the operation.
Why is it that the CIA is now in charge of military operations, and SEAL teams report to the CIA director?
A lot of questions are still unanswered about this, and unfortunately I doubt that the news media will do a thorough job of investigating and reporting. What is clear is that we still have a long way to go before we can recover from these military blunders. We have to live with these mistakes.
This should, however, help us reduce the $8 billion per month we are spending in Afghanistan significantly, and finally depart from Iraq, including the vast number of Blackwater-style mercenary contractors still there.
Ray Lutz, Citizens Oversight Projects
Editor's note: This originally was a response to a La Mesa Patch inquiry.
Joshu Poore
4:46 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
Where is the proof he is dead? Do we believe what the told us? They sure got rid of that body like they were hiding a secret? Display his body so i can throw rocks at it. If he pops up again does that mean he is the anti-Christ?
Michael Russell
11:08 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
Habeas Corpus ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habeas_corpus )
Miriam Raftery
5:40 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
AP reports DNA testing confirmed identity and my sources with intelligence ties informed me of this last night. From what NPR reports today, this was not an execution; there was a firefight and he was killed in the exchange, while trying to shield himself behind one of his wives.
US has DNA samples from relatives and the source that led them to bin Laden was one of his trusted couriers. It's possible that the courier may have obtained DNA off, say, a hair comb or toothbrush to confirm ID before the attack, too.
Ray raises an interesting point though about whether bin Laden would have been found years ago if troops hadn't been pulled out and sent to Iraq, and he is correct about the weapons of mass destruction. Some years ago I interviewed UN weapons inspector Scott Ritter who was appalled that his reports were not only listened to, but falsified by higher-ups in order to justify an invasion of Iraq by the prior administration. Asked why a report listed weapons when none were found, he said he was told "There will always be some weapons shown." Ritter was a conservative Republican who had no partisan motivation to lie.
Michael Russell
11:14 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
Why destroy the body in less than 24 hrs.? Just keep a finger, or an eye, to prove you got him. We are not an Islamic nation, we need not follow fundamentalist religious laws. They may have just thawed out Bin Laden from a freezer under the Pentagon. Or they might just be lying about the original DNA sample. Why not release the pictures and video? National Security? They kill who they want, they tell us what they want, and say 'trust me'. Not the way I want my government to act.
Estelle
7:50 pm on Wednesday, May 4, 2011
We know that you read the newspapers and listened to the news. You offer nothing just a repeat of what has already been reported.
Why did the US have Bin Laden family DNA? This sounds suspect to me. I doubt whether any member of his family came forward and said "Here, come get my DNA". There is more to this than is being told.
I don't think any effort was made to "bring 'em back alive". Is the courier going to get the 25M reward?
This just stinks.
Miriam Raftery
6:07 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
Correction to my comment earlier: MSNBC now reports the administration is backing off claims that bin Laden used one of his wives as a shield and say she may have been the wife of a courier. Also some of his wives and children were reportedly taken into US custody.
Doug Curlee
6:14 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
miriam.. doesn't really matter whether it was one of his wives or not..
the mere fact that he hid behind a woman is all the proof needed about who and what he was..
as i said in my column, he died as what he was.. a craven coward.
Miriam Raftery
6:37 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
Most bullies are really cowards at heart, and bin Laden was apparently no exception.
Sally
7:09 am on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
Cowardice is not a valid reason to murder any living creature, human or non. If the USA makes its policy to murder people who have killed others, in all fairness Obama, Bush, Cheney and countless predecessors have more blood on their hands than bin Laden, who is reportedly responsible for the deaths of some 200 people all tolled. This count pales in comparison to the hundreds of thousands of deaths the Presidents of the United States, past and present and undoubtedly future, are responsible for, in cold blood. American supremacy and arrogance is reprehensible. It is time the USA turns its focus to its own domestic problems and forgets its plight to rule the world. All we need do is look around us to see that we are hardly capable of taking care of our own country. What has given America the idea that it reigns supreme with the right to raze any foreign entity it fancies? Not every place on Earth wants to be converted to the American brand of "democracy."
Mark E. Smith
7:24 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
Ray Lutz wrote, "The proper way to handle this would be through indictments and a trial."
Yes, that is how things are done under the rule of law.
Obviously, that is no longer how the United States does things.
Branislav Bielik
7:18 am on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
pardon me, when was it the way they handle things?
I can accept people must have been angry upon 911 and I can understand they wanted to see actions but one person that is (even if he was directly affected by those events) objectively thinking without any prejudices has to admit that actions upon Afghanistan and Iraq were simple unjustified invasions of sovereign countries
I'm not trying to purposely attack US foreign policy by principle we all know that (if it's just for the Iraq) their actions haven't been justified explained or approved by most of international (even) supporters including UN and most of their actions (Guantanamo Bay etc.) are actually illegal by international law...
those are facts that most US citizens don't want to see and that's why most of the world is simply against whole USA
Dwain Deets
8:54 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
This is very much consistent with my thinking. I've been dismayed by the spin. starting with Pres. Obama in his late night announcement only referred to the connection to 9/11, as if it were a settled matter. All of the news broadcasts I heard today joined in to that spin. This even included BBC and NPR, each of which posture themselves as being objective. Clearly, they are not.
Dwain Deets
Encinitas
Beverly Brodsky
9:02 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
This is a sad day for America. We're acting like to bullies we're fighting. Over 80% 0f war casualties are innocent people, like the woman who was killed with him. Many are children.
Osama bin Laden was an old CIA asset, who probably died of natural causes. He was on kidney dialoysis for years.
As I listened to President Obama's speech, I wondered if he would announce an end to hostilities in Afghanistan. What are we doing in there?
Branislav Bielik
7:23 am on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
sadly that's enough for most US citizens to be happy
call me conspiracy theorist but I believe that as elections are closing in this information was purposely handed over to media to spread around the US for people to forget about their poor economic situation and as I saw reactions on yahoo news debate this simply couldn't work better for pres. Obama
great job indeed (but not for the action itself though)
then of course maybe it doesn't have to do anything with it but still it's sad how a democratic country received information about the kill of a man - no matter who he was...
it is a sad moment for humand kind civilization I really thought we're further than we actually are
Ray A
10:11 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
It's amazing how loosly the term "justice" has been thrown around today. The reported asassination of OBL by US forces was not an act of justice, it was an act of revenge, national hubris, or maybe bloodlust. Justice is achieved when a suspect is arrested, tried, and found guilty or innocent by a court of law. What we saw today was an orgy of propaganda that assumed that everything the government told us about the 9/11 attacks was true, when in fact is was the basis for series of lies that got us involved in two wars, and cost us a major chunk of our civil liberties. History tells us that countries that comit atrocities against other nations ultimately commit those same atrocities against their own people. So be careful how you apply the word "justice" to todays events, as you yourself may face the same "justice."
Miriam Raftery
10:28 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
There are conflicting reports on whether this was a "kill" operation or whether they were willing to take bin Laden alive if he surrendered. I hope it was the latter, as to execute a leader in a foreign country without attempting to take him alive would raise very troubling legal issues. It would have been more satisfying to see him tried for war crimes. But perhaps he was determined to fight to the death.
Tom Courbat
10:24 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrunverifiable! Dumped into the ocean? come on - just like the scaffolding from the twin towers were shipped overseas as quickly as possible. What exacly have we been fed over the years? 9/11 and all associated with it leave a touch of surreal Orwellian double speak, and dumping his body without a chance for the world to see it/him - NOT GOOD!!
yvm
10:33 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
I think there are some videos showing osama admitting himself that he is responsible for 9/11 attacks on wtc in usa.That may be right.The question here is how is pakistani govt or military not aware of US millitary entering in to his compund and about their flying vehicle and what is the proof that osama bin laden is dead, when they know that he is in the compound they could have shot him in the foot or hands or protect them selves in bullet proof and capture him in bare hamds and why would such a terrorist had no weapons with him or counter attack us personnel.
Michael Russell
11:19 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
Since he is dead, I guess we'll never know if he was just a scape-goat. We will never hear his side of the story. But this I know, reason is the best path to truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nIEn6Pcz7MY
Chris Sarns
12:01 am on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
yvm,
From the article above:
"The video supposedly documenting admission was an obvious contrivance and has been dismissed by investigators as reliable evidence."
Benazir Bhutto said OBL was murdered - at 6:10 in this interview:
http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/242.html
Osama bin photo-shopped?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=2ZY5BVGvuEE
Personally, I don't believe anything the government says, or hear on our corporate owned MSM.
Anna
12:59 am on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
Osama Bin Laden used his wife as a shield - what a horrible character. Good he is dead now, so we can all be much safer.
However: according to persons who were present, it is impossible to tell whether he was hiding behind the woman or if she stood out in front of him to protect him... if she was his wife and she loved him, she might have done that. So let that be a warning to all Muslim women: if someone tries to shoot your husband, don't put yourself in harm's way, because he will die anyway, and with a reputation for 'having used a woman as a shield'.
The media sensationalism and lack of interest in finding facts and evidence is sickening. Does anyone really believe that the world will be a safer place now?
Branislav Bielik
7:09 am on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
*I'd like to see a proof that he was indeed behind of 9/11
the way whole operation has been handled is just too suspicious (as many other US actions performed upon their foreign policy)
*I also don't accept the term 'world's most wanted' and especially not the term 'terrorist' as for me those terms are purposely made up terms for (mostly) US public to fool them into believing in something that (may not) be truth - I know he had been recognized internationally as global terrorist but I would rather accept his arrest more than murder and also if it was taken out by international forces as I US forces are not in position of take out such operations (as well as they're not in position to invade sovereign countries yet they do it without no consequences)
*I don't believe that navy seals once having the intel about his whereabouts wouldn't be able to capture him since I assume he wasn't prepared - that would make this operation pure murder - but we all know how US treats prisoners at Guantanamo
*even if he fought back what right had they to storm his house and arrest him on international soil? and why would one think he wouldn't struggle as he was attacked? (well this point may be taken out but I just can't accept many US actions outside their state so this one just goes among many others )
*the most shocking and unacceptable point on this whole issue is (for me) the celebration of this murder (or even if 'just' death) by (most) US people and it just sickens me
janet
12:45 pm on Wednesday, May 4, 2011
Alot of people have a problem in the fact that they feel he was murdered, and people celebrated. You know what they celebrated when our people were falling from burning buildings, and when they were being scorched alive. I'm not rejoicing in his death but if he did commit those acts of terror he was then our enemy. Have you ever talked to a muslim over there they have such a hatred for Israel that they see nothing else but their destruction and anyone elses that would provide them aide. Thats what this war is really about they are jealous of the fact that we defend Israel. They need to get over it!! Everyone talks about the USA being all up in other countries business, well stop coming to us crying all the time!!! You know what really sickens me is the fact that we cry all the time, pointing the finger at that people we put in office instead of supporting them. Our people are over there giving their lives for our freedom and theirs and you question? President Obama I know that your doing your best with what you have. Just keep defending Israel and God will continue to bless America!!!
Kathy
8:15 am on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
Again, Mr. Lutz opening his mouth for his own Political attention. I have a suggestion Mr. Lutz, why don’t you move to Afghanistan and live with those who support a Murderer, like Osama Bin Laden, since it is clear YOU do.
How can you be so disrespectful to our Military Forces that risk and have given their lives, so you can sit over here in the United States and run your disrespectful mouth? Why don’t you ask all of those FAMILY members that lost their loved ones on 9/11, if they feel we should have stuck our tail between our legs and let this man to continue to live and MURDER innocent lives?
If you had any knowledge, let alone of the Muslin faith, you would know that the body must be put to rest within 24 hours of a death. You would also know that the United States has used every resource to track this MURDER and waited for the perfect opportunity to achieve their goal, DEAD OR ALIVE. Your friend, Osama Bin Laden, choose NOT to surrender, and choose like the rest of those insane, suicide, Bin Laden followers, to die rather than be captured.
I believe in an Eye for an Eye, and I have never been so proud of our Military Forces, the United States of America has the BEST Military Forces. So Mr. Lutz, since you are so in need of visually seeing this MURDERER with a bullet on his head and his brains, or should I say lack of, watch your news media today.
Sally
8:31 am on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
Kathy, all lives are innocent, and there is no difference between the members of our military that murder innocent children for American self-justification and those who we label "murderers." We preempted the invasion of Iraq ostensibly because Saddam Hussein was behind 9/11 and because America felt it was its noble duty to convert that country to its idea of "democracy." Since there has been no draft since the inception of the American occupation of the Middle East a decade ago, those who arm themselves in the name of patriotism do so of their own volition. Please do not condemn Mr. Luts for expressing his concern over the murder of a fellow human being. Like it or not, murder is murder is murder, regardless of who has committed the murder and for what reasons. Who are we to second-guess the traditions and beliefs of a cultur other than our own unless we have highly educated ourselves to sufficiently understand one another? This American killing mentality, all to support our addiction to oil, must be healed.
Kathy
1:01 pm on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
Sally, why don't you and Lutz take your self righteous attitude and go speak with all the Family members that lost their love ones on 9/11 and see what their response is. So, you are saying that is your Husband, Wife or children was murdered on 9/11, you would say "that's O.K., because it was a human being that did it"? You are sorely mistaken to even consider Osama Bin Laden a human being, he was an animal and savage.
If you and Lutz do not appreciate the United States of America Military Force, then I suggest you both GET OUT OF MY COUNTRY. There is no room for either of you in the United States, for your attitude and perhaps you both would enjoy living in Afganistan. You truly DISGUST me with your attitude towards of troops.
Kathy
8:17 am on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
Mr. Lutz and the rest of you posters that make the pathetic remark, that he should not of been killed by our Military Forces in self defense, do you think he asked all of those who were MURDERED on 9/11, is it O.K. that I MURDER you in cold blood?
I am so ashamed of each and every one of you that condemned our Military Forces for removing another MURDERER from this earth. So you want proof, well watch the news media and you will see your proof. Are you aware that the DNA results were 99.9% conclusive that it was Osama Bin Laden? Will this satisfy you, probably not, because you will still believe that it was not him?
Mitchell Ryan Kramb
12:01 pm on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
Why in the hell can't you get it through your HEAD that Bin Laden was NOT wanted for the 9/11 attacks, because the FBI did not have the evidence necessary to make a case! READ the article!
Branislav Bielik
12:45 am on Wednesday, May 4, 2011
Kathy
with all due respect, let's be a little bit open minded for a while.
*OBL has been indeed internationally recognized as terrorist (yet there's no proof he was behind 911) but does it give right to US forces to kill him? I believe it doesn't. If he was captured and tried nobody would say a thing - but then ad1 was he really killed ? and ad2 would they find a thing they could put a charge against him for?
*as I stated before if you had gun and armed unit would storm your house (what right did they have?) I think you would defend yourself too, yet there's no proof they killed him in self defense, precision shot just next to the eye suggests otherwise
*force and killings should never be a solution for a problem but do you and people like you even care? we're living in 21st century and yet I feel like in middle ages. Is that really what makes us human? Being able to kill each other just for the fun of it?
*the most ridiculous point you presented was notion about innocent lives of your armed forces... I mean really? let's think for a while (forget Afghanistan for the moment) and let's talk about Iraq (though it's not the only case) so your forces invaded Iraq without approval of UN security council (please do your homework and find out it's rather illegal) in the name of hunt for WMD but the intel was a lie from the beginning (otherwise you'd found some WMD there) ok so you found another reason - to capture Hussein and bring democracy for the country. I'm asking
Branislav Bielik
12:55 am on Wednesday, May 4, 2011
what right did you have to invade sovereign country, what right did you have to kill thousands innocent lives and what right did you have to bring democracy (that even you in the USA don't have) to sovereign country, who asked you and who acknowledged it?
*innocent lives of your troops, troops that killed thousands innocent lives, innocent troops that created tens hundred thousands of so called 'terrorist' - if some invading soldier killed your whole family I believe you'd be pretty pissed of too yet you dare to call them innocent...
*what right did you have to pick Iraq if there are tens of countries with worse situation (most of them African) where people are suffering much more under the lead of their dictators but you just don't give a damn about them do you?
*please be aware that nobody found any connection between Saddam and Al Qaeda which was allegedly the reason you were after him
*also, there is no proof that Al Qaeda or any other terrorist group was behind 911
*my last point: imagine that US citizen will blow a nuke in some larger country than you are and that country would invade USA killing innocent citizens in the name of hunt for terrorists - just after that they would change the fight for fight for democracy
**my question is: do you really, honestly stand behind your point and can't you see just a little bit the absurdness of the whole situation?
***try to be as much emphatic as you can be and answer this Q honestly
Tom Yarnall
11:21 am on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
I believe this whole thing is a big conspiracy and Obama is hiding Bin Laden in Rev. Wright's mansion in Chicago.
I think my analysis is as good as anything said in these postings.
Mitchell Ryan Kramb
12:00 pm on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
It is SUCH a relief to read a news story that is FACTUAL, amidst all of this propaganda and all of these brain dead, zombie Americans.
You can sit here and spout of useless, totally irrelevant comments about how he allegedly shielded himself with his wife, or how there was a gunfight - and because of all this, he was a bad man and deserved to die - but you CAN'T alter the FACTS, that by the FBI's own admission, there was no evidence linking Bin Laden to 9/11, NOR did he confess! And please don't give me that 9/11 video from Bin Laden as 'evidence,' because it is unsubstantiated and clearly not sufficient for the FBI to provide to the Justice Department. When the Washington Post OPENLY ADMITS a few years ago that the CIA intended to FAKE Saddam Hussein videos showing him having sex with 7 year old boys to spread around to the people of Iraq, and that they had created fake Bin Laden videos as well to portray him in a bad light . . . I would just hope people are smart enough to not be this gullible anymore.
Tom Yarnall
2:57 pm on Tuesday, May 3, 2011
Thank you Don. I'm sure you are relieved to have that off your chest.
By the way, I also believe that Obama's Kenyan birth certificate is in Rev. Wright's safe.
Thughunter
9:33 pm on Wednesday, May 4, 2011
Good One! Gave me a riotous laugh!
While we're on the topic...
I can't for the life of me understand why the OBL death photos won't be released. Consider that they will, someday in the future, either be leaked or released, That's a given. Between right now and when that happens, there will crop up scads of photoshopped or altered "fakes" purporting to be the real deal. And when the REAL photos are released, we, having seen dozens of fakes already, will lament "Oh, that's nice, another fake OBL picture" and no one will believe it when the real ones emerge.
Better to release them NOW and derail all the budding photoshoppers out there who will surely have us all "googling" for the photos between now and when hell freezes over.
Maybe this president will wait two years and spend 2.2 million dollars to keep the photos unseen.
And then release FAKES! Sound familiar?
Tom Yarnall
9:54 am on Wednesday, May 4, 2011
Kathy,
Do you find it amusing when a liberal tells you to be open minded as he presents his closed minded rhetoric?
Miriam Raftery
11:47 pm on Wednesday, May 4, 2011
FBI warns not to open bin Laden death photos, as the fakes circulating online have some malicious viruses that can damage your computer and also steal your identity.
Ray Lutz
11:07 am on Friday, May 6, 2011
I think that is mostly a hoax. Generally, there is no real danger is opening images if they are properly attached to the email, as long as they are .jpg or other image format. These are not executable files and do not pose any virus risk. However, you must not open .zip, .com, .exe file because they are generally dangerous. The reason you don't want to necessarily view images in emails is because the emails can contain a reference to executables if they are embedded in the email itself. Generally, these executables contain only tracking scripts to keep track of who has opened the email, and do not have the ability to deposit any virus on your system. However they can result in additional spam if you open the images in an email.
Michael Rothchild
5:02 pm on Thursday, May 5, 2011
President Obama and our government's biggest mistake with this issue is- forgetting that we are in the Everyone-Knows-Everything-About-Everybody Era. REAL FACTS can NOT be hidden because information is now freely and instantly available. People want to know everything about everyone and they freely share information about themselves with the world. When you have this kind of instant bliss, you better be prepared to provide valid and instant proof of something you say has occured. So it is hardly an insane request by the non-"believers" that our government 1.) Provide proof that Osama Bin Laden (Tim Osman) killed all those people at the WTC on 911 (Like Obama said he did) and (2.) Show us proof that you have actually killed the man. There is no conspiracy here- just a request for cold hard facts. Hardly a difficult nor outlandish request.
Eileen george
10:17 am on Friday, May 6, 2011
Choctaw Institute
People we live in USA the democratic government law is to prove him guilty first which the Constitution has given in our laws (by the way this law was first here In America before it was taken over in the past copied after the Iroquois and Choctaw Confederacies ,which are the people who Manifest destiny fought against in America) and another law as native American Choctaw people belief is this we don't ever talk about the dead ,we believe we have two spirit people don't stop all this hoopla la his Spirit will not rest ,it will not leave the earth! Along time ago I lived in Mississippi the most segregated state in the USA- a ole Choctaw sharecropper told me "You will see all the world coming on that stone road to our people ,it is true as America can only coin Geronimo(by the way is language of the Mexican Indian people)..Eileen George -Choctaw Institute Lemon Grove,Ca